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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:07 am 
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Joined: Fri May 13, 2016 2:42 am
Posts: 130
Location: Da Nang City Vietnam
Boat Name: Alphington
Oilking wrote:
Lionel,
Your work is beautiful. Finding that you are doing this on manual machines has kicked me over center to get moving on some projects of my own.

Thanks for the inspiration.
Dave

PS: As a Boiler Tech on the USS Fanning DE1076, on January 8,1973 I was in Da Nang harbor where we anchored long enough to receive mail and personal headed for the gun line. While there the monthly missile hit the air base fuel storage prompting our hasty departure. After all these years I never thought I'd be in communication with someone living there, and very glade that the circumstances are much for the better.


Thanks for your kind comments, machining is my love and not just a job or a hobby or a business.

I have been here in Da Nang for 6 years, the growth here now is just beyond belief, if you saw Da Nang now it would blow your mind. In just 6 years I have seen growth that I would never have thought possible. I was lucky enough to get in before the price of land went crazy. My wife is Vietnamese and she runs the electronics manufacturing side of my business here while I play in my workshop.


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:12 am 
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Joined: Fri May 13, 2016 2:42 am
Posts: 130
Location: Da Nang City Vietnam
Boat Name: Alphington
TahoeSteam wrote:
Lionel,

I just read this! Your ambitions are something I've been wanting to explore for quite some time but have been struggling with find a facility here in the US that would be willing to work me on cooperatively small scale production. I have all the patterns for the engine in my launch, and with a good foundry could be produced with enough consistency to allow for CNC.

I'd love to see more of your facility and your engine. I guess I'll have to stop to getting a Facebook account again.

~Wes


Hi Wes,

There are plenty of pictures in the albums on my Facebook page, the link is in my posts above.

I have a number of CNC machines, the most impressive is my DMG MORI NTX1000, here is a video of one running tat the manufacturers showroom https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VkCRrC8E6g

To make anything efficiently by CNC the parts need to be designed with CNC in mind, unfortunately engines that were designed to be built by hobbyists using rough castings and conventional machining don't usually lend themselves to efficient production via CNC. This is why your local CNC machinists avoid hobbyists, it's is too hard to make a dollar when your customer is not up to speed with your machining methods. When a manufacturer designs a product to be made by a specific machine or set of machines he sets his designers with the brief that they must use a specific set of tools that are always available in the machine. This way, set up and programming time is kept to a minimum. In my 9 axis machine I can make a con rod, a piston, a crank shaft and a big end bolt and not need to change a single tool in the machine, IF, I stick to this rule of design. When using castings the designer needs to make allowance for datum and clamping points to be easily and repeatably machined onto the casting prior to the main machining process, this often requires special lugs to be included in the casting that may later be removed.

Short run production can absolutely be done efficiently by CNC, IF, the design of the product is carried out correctly.


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:22 am 
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Joined: Fri May 13, 2016 2:42 am
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Location: Da Nang City Vietnam
Boat Name: Alphington
cyberbadger wrote:
TahoeSteam wrote:
Understanding today's generation of youth, they're going to be more interested in "instant" gratification which could potentially in the long run get them hooked enough to build something more substantial like a casting kit.

Very true. Personally I find machining intimidating and I own a benchtop mill and benchtop lathe. :| I have not attempted an engine. I get very hung up on the prospect of spending a lot of work and then ruining a casting or piece I can't easily replace. That inclination turns into a catch 22 that can prevent you from ever gaining the experience you need to gain at some point to start becoming a better machinist. :/


-CB


IF you start on Stuart model engines you can easily get replacement castings, there have been books written for almost every engine that they make which detail every machining step involved in producing the engine. Most of their kits come with all material and all fasteners so you don't even have to waste time shopping around for parts to complete the engines.

The best way to get ahead is to just lift up one foot and lean forward, nature will look after the rest.


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:58 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2011 6:41 pm
Posts: 644
Location: Middle Earth
Boat Name: B.N.Y.S.
Lionel Connell wrote:
cyberbadger wrote:
TahoeSteam wrote:
Understanding today's generation of youth, they're going to be more interested in "instant" gratification which could potentially in the long run get them hooked enough to build something more substantial like a casting kit.

Very true. Personally I find machining intimidating and I own a benchtop mill and benchtop lathe. :| I have not attempted an engine. I get very hung up on the prospect of spending a lot of work and then ruining a casting or piece I can't easily replace. That inclination turns into a catch 22 that can prevent you from ever gaining the experience you need to gain at some point to start becoming a better machinist. :/


-CB


IF you start on Stuart model engines you can easily get replacement castings, there have been books written for almost every engine that they make which detail every machining step involved in producing the engine. Most of their kits come with all material and all fasteners so you don't even have to waste time shopping around for parts to complete the engines.

The best way to get ahead is to just lift up one foot and lean forward, nature will look after the rest.


I like the analogy. Well said! Gold star given.

If you never try, you never will, and like all things, practice makes perfect.

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Retirement is about doing what floats your boat!

A BODGE : - A Bit Of Damn Good Engineering.


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:23 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2013 9:16 pm
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Location: Northeast Ohio, USA
Boat Name: SL Nyitra
Are you suggesting: https://i.redd.it/c6a9cw1pj6501.jpg

;)

Ok - back to Lionels Alphington steam launch!

-CB


Last edited by cyberbadger on Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 4:17 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:38 am
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Location: South Lake Tahoe, CA, USA
Boat Name: Wayward Belle
Lionel,

Given a good foundry with attention to detail I believe the castings produced by the patterns I have would hold very close to finished tolerances, requiring minimal material removal. None of them would require any out of this world machining operations or jigs. Being designed for six turned columns also helps as then there's just a lot of simple machining of barstock.

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Check out the steamboat videos on my YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/c/wesleyharcourtsteamandmore


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 3:20 am 
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Joined: Fri May 13, 2016 2:42 am
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Location: Da Nang City Vietnam
Boat Name: Alphington
Here are some images of the CAD design of the building jig for my Alphington steam launch, work on the jig begins next week.
The jig frame is build in steel, the moulds will be CNC routed water proof MDF. Inner keel and stem along with engine/boiler bearers in White Oak will all be loaded into the jig before planking. The floors, also in white oak will be loaded into the jig and shaped fair to the jig moulds then removed prior to planking to make cleaning up of the inside of the hull easier prior to glassing.

Image
[img]https://scontent.fdad1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/26170123_1920825958245956_2373107108673507455_o.png?oh=a130ab0ab53fbc089f895ff7aa053814&oe=5AC8D642[img]
[/img]https://scontent.fdad1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/26026085_1920826004912618_8650403065812190912_o.png?oh=9b9707706ed5f39e6f117db2d1899f51&oe=5AC23E41[/img]
Image
Image


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:36 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:38 am
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Boat Name: Wayward Belle
That's a good looking hull Lionel. What are you going to use for planking and in what construction method?

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Check out the steamboat videos on my YouTube page: https://www.youtube.com/c/wesleyharcourtsteamandmore


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:49 am 
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Location: Neubrandenburg, Germany
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Hi Lionel,

will you mill the sides of the strips concave/convex? Such planks will glue together more easy and are stronger.

Best Dietrich


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 Post subject: Re: Alphington Steam launch
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:58 am 
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Joined: Fri May 13, 2016 2:42 am
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Location: Da Nang City Vietnam
Boat Name: Alphington
Hi Dietrich,

In answer to your question YES, I will use Bead and Cove strips.

I have been building model RC Model Aeroplanes since I was 10 years old, but I have never built a boat. I decided that I could save a lot of time and probably material and money, if I built a model of my launch first and developed a good understanding of the processes. But I have strip planked many model planes with balsa and finished them with 3/4oz cloth and epoxy.

So while building my 6A engine I also built a 1/5 scale model of my launch, I used the exact same materials and construction method that I will use for my full sized launch. You can see all of the pictures of building the model hull on my Facebook Page Alphington Industries. The link is below.

I machined all of my own planking strips for the model and I will machine the strips for the full sized boat as well.

Having now been though all of the building steps to build the model I am sure that I can shave hundreds of hours on the full sized build.



If you follow my Facebook page you will see all of the pictures of my full size boat build as it happens.

Image

Image

Image
https://scontent.fdad2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/ ... e=5AF753BD

https://www.facebook.com/pg/steam.launch/photos/?tab=album&album_id=1844005619261324

Best regards

Lionel


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